where did it all go wrong for Holden?

"pip bip - choose Corrour" (hhgttg69)
06/03/2020 at 08:23 • Filed to: Holden, 1948-2020, GM, General Motors, RIP

where did it go wrong for Holden?

here’s my $0.02c

1. poor range - build quality and engin eering let them down. too reliant on GM Korea/GMDAT/Daewoo

2. Holden management - 10 different managing directors at Holden in 16 years

3. GM management - selling Opel / Vauxhall to PSA

4. GM retreating from all RHD markets in the world and only focusing on a few key markets. lets face it Toyota are doing ok and so too are VW.

5. GM going into chapter 11 in 2009 didn’t help. causing a freeze on new models coming through the system.

6. GM HQ accountants for loading up GM European operation with debt then complaining it doesn’t make a profit. yet PSA managed to make it profitable very quickly.

7. GM Management for focusing on share price.

8. ending local production was a bad move. they needed to move on and go with what people were buying instead of clinging on to the past.

9. too many brands in the local market hasn’t helped.

10. Holden for having a poor marketing strategy. too many rushed decisions.

AC Acadia 2019-2020

2021 Equinox (we will never get - no loss honestly)

!!!CAPTION ERROR: MAY BE MULTI-LINE OR CONTAIN LINK!!! Kinja'd!!!

last VF Holden Commodore built October 2017

!!!CAPTION ERROR: MAY BE MULTI-LINE OR CONTAIN LINK!!! Kinja'd!!!

TK Barina 2006-2011

TM Barina series 2 (2017-2018)

TJ Trax series 1 (2013-2016)

TJ Trax series 2 (2017-2020)

CG Captiva series 1 2007-2010 (C100)

CG Captiva7 2011-2018 (C100 series 2)

CG Captiva Maxx/5 2006-2015 (C105)

MJ Barina Spark 2011-2015

MP Spark 2016-2018

BL Astra 2017-2018

JF Viva 2006-2009

JG Cruze 2010 only

JH Cruze 2011-2016

JH Cruze wagon 2013-2015

EP Epica 2007-2011

EM Malibu 2013-2015 ( production of MY15 continued into 2017)

thoughts?

DISCUSSION (35)

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 09:21

“ 6. GM HQ accountants for loading up GM European operation with debt then complaining it doesn’t make a profit. yet PSA managed to make it profitable very quickly.”

easy when you lay off 1/2 t he staff over 3 years.

ranwhenparked > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 09:25

They should have put Barina Girl in charge, promote someone from within who knew the business.

Brickman > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 09:26

All those pictures made me go back to sleep

LongbowMkII > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 09:36

Being based in Australia was a poor choice.

I honestly don’t think anything could’ve stopped the economic realities of small scale car production and the high import/export costs of parts and cars.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 09:48

Wait, what’s the deal with the Captiva? We got one generation here and it was pretty terrible all around and very few were dumb en ough to buy one.

And what's the Epica? I so don't understand the letters before each one.

I recognized all but like 2 of those cars and most of them were America’s soggy leftovers .

Gone > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 09:50

11. The wife hasn’t gotten transferred to Australia yet so we didn’t get to buy new a Holden Colorado and Commodore. This lands solely at the feet of her superiors obviously. :(

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
06/03/2020 at 09:52

Wasn’t the Captiva only sold into “fleet sales”? Meaning the dealers got no new stock, but the rental car fleets got boatloads. I would see them “used” on the lots a few years later, but never knew how Parts-and-Service worked for GM cars that had never sold in GM dealers.

I rented one a couple of times, by accident, and it was kinda “meh”, but ok for a fake tiny CUV

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
06/03/2020 at 09:57

Everything about them just didn’t seem very substantial though. Never kne w they were fleet only but it doesn't surprise me. Can't imagine the parts network is very good, like about as bad as the Chevy Caprice that was a Holden.

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 10:02

To sum up; their vis ion, their product, their leadership, and their workers.

Got it.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
06/03/2020 at 10:06

I remember seeing this in the Times at the time.

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/01/automobiles/autoreviews/a-chevy-so-exclusive-that-you-can-only-borrow-not-buy.html

I just bought a Police Caprice, so I’m about to find out how hard it is to get Holden parts for that car. It’s got an odd version of the LY6 motor in it too. I should write this purchase experience up.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 10:14

It must be really sad being an Aussie car guy trying to buy a new car.

Also shame on GM for killing the Ute instead of brining it here

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
06/03/2020 at 10:22

Congratulations! I love those cars and the Caprice isn't as crazy inflated I'm value but I don't love the parts supply.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
06/03/2020 at 10:28

I’m fascinated by the L77 motor— which looks, on paper at least, to be an all-aluminum LS2... but with better heads.

People are deleting DoD/AFM, putting a bit more cam-and-springs and making LS7 levels of power.

It’s admittedly wrapped in a Plain-Jane body. I much, much, MUCH preferred the G8 body style.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
06/03/2020 at 10:30

Just read that article.

“I paid $56 a day to Budget Rent a Car at the Bentonville airport, where in the past I have rented midsize sedans for less than $25 a day.

And if, like me, you fail to grasp the logic of paying that much more for a crossover S.U.V. while getting little extra in the way of seating or storage — well, that’s your problem.”

I like this guy’s take. He makes an interesting point here. GM did something similar with your Caprice for no good reason really. That could have been a great sleeper sports sedan in an otherwise boring lineup without the pounds and pounds of cop stuff (be careful aren't mistaken).

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
06/03/2020 at 10:35

It is a true sleeper though. I wonder if that all aluminum LS could have taken off with the muscle crowd given wide enough circulation? Might have been a major switch in preference.

I prefer the not-a-GTO but the G8 was pretty sharp looking. They still are pretty expensive. More expensive than they should be.

dogisbadob > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 10:46

GM might as well be run by Donald Trump

They learned absolutely nothing from the crash, NUMMI, or anything else. Fuck them.

They should’ve exported the real Holdens big V8 RWD shit on a larger scale. A base V6 version of the GTO, selling the Commodore sedan full time since they killed the B-body, giving us the Australian Catera with the 3800 instead of the German one with that shitty V6. They could’ve sold their ute as an El Camino, but instead we got the shitty SSR

But instead, they got ANGRY when a dealer DARED sell a Caprice to a retail customer. They actually got pissed off that someone bought one of their cars!

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
06/03/2020 at 10:51

It’s hilarious how much following the G8 has. They still bring huge $$ in the after-market. And? If you can even find a GXP with a stick? Oh, those are dear.

I always laugh, having done a bunch of LS swaps, to see how much people will pay for an “authentic” LS1 in aluminum despite the fact that 23 years later you have a LOT of better options in 6.0 and 6.2 displacements— but most of them carry the stigma of being “truck” engines. Even though they are more refined, have fewer miles and are much better designed by now.

I have a 6.0 (iron) LQ4 with ‘243 LS6 heads and a middle-ish cam. It is an absolute monster in my E46 wagon. Being able to find 6.2s in aluminum, with the newer LS3 heads just opens up big power options for a fraction of the cost of an “authentic” LS1.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish
06/03/2020 at 11:02

There is reason why cars produce a lot more power today than they did 50 years ago so if you can, I don’t see why you wouldn’t go with a modern rendition of a classic engine. Woah, you have an LQ4 5 series wagon? How have I never heard of this?

Were any other USDM cars offered with the LQ4? I can't remember any others. Truck engines are good though because they have the bottom end torque.

I have an LS, but it is just the base trim on the Cruze and comes with 136 lethargic ponies, some of whom have been permanently furloughed by power sucking autobox.

When you have that much power though, a stick is less of a big deal because you can accelerate in any gear. There is a reason bug displacement engines and 3 and 4 speed primitive automatics wer e usually paired together while small power and a manual makes for some low speed fun.

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
06/03/2020 at 11:25

The wagon was an E46 323iT 3-series, although I have an E39 roller wagon that needs something more substantial in it too.

LQ4 was built by the millions— mainly 2500 series Silvierras, and a lot of Express/Savana van s. Was also standard issue in 3/4 ton Suburbans and Yukons too. Very plentiful. Look for “U” as the 8th character in the VIN.

It’s a great starting point- strong, strong iron block. Boost friendly compression and an infinite choice of cams and aftermarket stuff. And, a lot less expensive than a full LS1

BahamaTodd > dogisbadob
06/03/2020 at 12:03

You think trying to sell sedans would have saved Holden? Sedans are not selling, margins are small, and building them all the way down in Australia would make them too expensive to be viable. M anufacturing in Australia was never going to be viable and should have ended decades ago. The Australian market is too small to support it.

BahamaTodd > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
06/03/2020 at 12:06

1. PSA a cquires Opel;

2. Ends majority of development and lays off 1/2 of the staff, yet sales of current line-up continue;

3. ???

4. Profit!

BahamaTodd > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 12:12

GM’s biggest mistake with Holden and all the other brands that have died is they kept all the brands separate. Ford did it the right way. Domestically and globally, all you have is Ford in every market they entered.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > pip bip - choose Corrour
06/03/2020 at 12:17

Don’t have any thoughts on Holden but I like the grille on your Acadia much better than the USDM one

Kinja'd!!!

dogisbadob > BahamaTodd
06/03/2020 at 12:45

Not *just* sedans, but I also mentioned the ute, and I also mentioned how exporting to a country 10x its size might help as well, even if not all of our cars came from there. Even if the cars were made in both countries, it is still cheaper to make one car than two.

They could also manufacture trucks and shit there as well

It’s as if GM has never seen a Charg er or 300

BahamaTodd > dogisbadob
06/03/2020 at 13:36

A two door car based truck based on an expensive RWD car wouldn’t stand a chance in the US. Two door anything is already a niche. An ute would be a niche of a niche. Only 5% of fullsize pickup sales are regular cabs.

The 300/Charger are built in North America using a 15 year old platform. The development costs were recovered long ago and its all profit no matter how few they make. An Australian built car could never be competitive. Australia is too far away to be shipping components all the way there, assembling them, then shipping vehicles all the way back.

Trucks are not happening - Chicken Tax

Side note: W e did almost get a Zeta platform based RWD Impala and Buick along with the 5th gen Camaro to be built in Canada . But the bankruptcy killed those cars.